How about an e-QSL award for islands, grids, Europe, SSTV, QRP, DX50, Canada, 1000 or any untold number of subjects. Awards, awards and more award requests. Is that all e-QSL is supposed to do, generate awards for using their service?

Are you saying that if the e-QSL Organization can not provide you with an award you don't want the e-QSL's. Or are you saying to others " I don't want your e-QSL unless your AG Certified and a new contact for some award or another"? Are you saying " I don't want your e-QSL from Florida, New York, California or other areas with large numbers of amateur radio operators because I already have an AG Certified e-QSL from your area and I don't want to be bothered with your e-QSL."? Under those circumstances I'm sure your not going to bother to upload your QSO's into the e-QSL system if you already have AG Certified e-QSL's for that award, whatever it might be. Which, in turn, will generate the complaint from the membership, "Why don't I get more e-QSL's?".

Be content with the awards offered. E-QSL.cc has the right to set the requirements for their awards as they see fit. Look to other organizations to provide various operating awards. There are hundreds of awards already out there. The ARRL is not the only game in town. Let e-QSL.cc do what it was designed to do and does extremely well and that is "To provide a means of exchanging QSL cards confirming QSO's between two amateur radio stations electronically through the internet.

Why does everyone have to be AG certified ? If e-QSL wants to offer certification and some members want to be certified, fine so be it. I wonder if all the indivuals clamering for "mandatory AG Status for membership" would be just as vocal supporting "mandatory Gold Level membership?

Why not just eliminate all e-QSL Awards and eliminate the fuss ?

73 and good DXing,

Bruce, KØARY/VP9

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K0ARY/VP9 Bruce B Quayle Jr

>Why does everyone have to be AG certified ? If e-QSL wants to offer certification and some
>members want to be certified, fine so be it. I wonder if all the indivuals clamering for "mandatory
>AG Status for membership" would be just as vocal supporting "mandatory Gold Level
>membership?

Everyone should be AG certified to reduce or eliminate the primary objection that organizations like ARRL, and as far as I can tell many hams, have toward accpeting eQSLs. Doing so would also put eQSL in DIRECT competition with LoTW, and in a very positive way (because eQSL is much easier to use, IMO).

Although I have gold membership, I don't see how making that mandatory would improve anything over mandatory AG. I like to think that people who find eQSL useful would at least throw a few bucks at it on occasion, however. The particular colour of anyone's membership has never concerned me, but AG or not does affect me.

I agree that it is possible to go overboard with the awards. That said, if the objective of eQSL is to get people to move away from paper QSL cards, then it's probably a reasonable expectation for eQSL to support analogs of paper QSL awards. Whether or not you enjoy award hunting, the fact is that many hams have those awards as their own personal goals. If eQSL can't support those goals, those hams will not participate, and that lowers the value of eQSL for everyone.

>Are you saying " I don't want your e-QSL from Florida, New York, California or other areas
>with large numbers of amateur radio operators because I already have an AG Certified
>e-QSL from your area and I don't want to be bothered with your e-QSL."?

I would hope that no ham behaves in that manner. IMO, one of the primary barriers to getting people into the hobby and having those new peopel maintain their interest is amateur radio elitism. Yes, I have encountered this "I don't need to talk to you because I have a QSL from VE3 on this band and mode" attitude, and it's in my book with the "I won't chat with you because your 10 WPM code isn't good enough for me" attitude, and the "When I had to get my licence we needed to communicate with smoke signals and banging rocks, and if you don't know how to do that you're not a real radio amateur" attitude. It's not just eQSL-related, it pervades the whole hobby, and it's very off-putting to someone new to amateur radio. Anyone who thinks that this sort of behaviour is OK should take a good look around at their next gathering of amateurs and ask themselves where those people will be in 10 or 15 years.

This is a long way of saying that your argument is a non-sequitur. Yes, when I chat with people I prefer AG eQSL, but I would never dream of giving someone the e-Finger because they're not AG. I will encourage them to go AG!

I like to think that the majority of hams think as I do.

For reference, I have sent out 693 AG eQSLs since last June.

In response, I've received 324 eQSLs for a return rate of 46.7% Of those, they're split almost 5:1 in favour of AG. This tells me that the leap to AG-required is a small one.

It appears to me that the people who more actively combine computers and radio are much better about returning eQSLs and that, for the most part, non-AG seems to be a minority of eQSL users. If you want good return rates, work PSK, which returns about 70% and of the returns about 90% are AG. CW and phone have much lower return rates.

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VE3OIJ P. Darin Cowan
Edited by VE3OIJ P. Darin Cowan on Jul 3, 2007 at 03:05 PM

Darin,

Thank you for you thoughtful reply !

I definitely don’t propose “Gold” membership being mandatory and the color of one’s membership is not an issue with me but again why should AG Certification be mandatory? No organization can verify the honesty or integrity its membership. AG Certification verifies that some type of documentation has been submitted of which the authenticity of which can not really be confirmed. In the computer age it is not that difficult to falsify documents.
How is eQSL going to AG Certify contacts with county-hunters as they move from county to county or portable stations operating from another state during their vacation?

As an example I have three AG Certified accounts with operating locations in St Louis and Bermuda operating under three different call signs. My AG Certification passes on to all of my new accounts. I could just as easily have more accounts in any other location I might choose. If I wanted to be dishonest I could operate from just one location and say I was at one of the other account locations. So what can my AG Certification really verify? It only counts for an award eQSL Award. So, again, why not eliminate the eQSL awards? Or eliminate AG certification?

Why does eQSL have to be in DIRECT competition with LoTW? I fully support the ARRL and am an active member. LoTW is designed for ARRL award credit only. I can’t put a LoTW credit in a file, an album, a screensaver, or hang it on the wall or show it to a friend but I can do those things with an eQSL. What other awards accept LoTW credits? I don’t know of any that do. But some organizations do accept eQSLs.

The purpose of eQSL.cc as stated in “About Us” on the home page is:

“eQSL.cc is the … global electronic QSL card exchange for amateur radio operators and SWLs. It is designed to be the fastest, easiest, and cheapest way to exchange QSO confirmations, eliminating the cost and time that regular QSL cards have required for the past half century.”

As a secondary goal:

“It is another goal of ours to make arrangements with … other amateur organizations to ensure that they will accept our eQSLs for awards and contests.”

ARRL awards are not the only awards out there. RAC awards do not require the submission of any particular type of QSL cards only verification by two amateurs that the individual applying for the award has the QSL cards. Would you accept non-AG Certified eQSLs for the RAC awards? I would. I don’t think the new ham is going to devalue the receipt of a “rare DX” eQSL because it is not AG Certified.

I have been licensed since 1955. It was common practice back then to send QSL cards as a post card. The DX cards would on occasion arrive with a foreign postage stamp on the card. It was a suitable validation when checking the cards. It has been quite a few years since I have received QSL cards as postcards, most arrive in envelopes or through a bureau. I am also aware of the attitudes of which you spoke. Those and similar thoughts and opinions have been around amateur community longer than I have.

As a member of eQSL I also promote the AG Certification but don’t feel it should be a mandatory requirement for membership. Gratefully the AG Certification is FREE. I know many amateurs chase awards. I have a few myself. I would like to see more effort directed toward gaining acceptance of eQSLs by award issuing organizations.

I upload all of my QSO’s into eQSL but I believe there are many members who do not. I can understand that for those who do not use computer logging programs. I also know that it takes time and effort to maintain a eQSL account.

I have uploaded 3,579 AG Certified eQSLs since last June. Approximately 70% of my contacts are non-US or non-Canadian QSO’s. My return rate is about 20% and mostly non-AG Certified. I agree that there is a higher return rate for PSK, RTTY and SSTV QSO’s than CW or SSB. However, I am a DX station to all of my contacts.

73,
Bruce, KØARY/VP9

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K0ARY/VP9 Bruce B Quayle Jr

A response to the first post really.

I in my own mind make no contact between eQSL awards and wanting/not wanting eqsls off people. It strikes me as a beginning of internal war splitting eqsl users where the real battle is to let others know the value of eqsl.

I quite like the awards and I suggested the Islands award as with many of the other awards its something we do already and adds that little nice interest to something that’s otherwise quite lmited and functional. (ok for some but then ignore the rest and just use it that way – nobody makes you). There maybe moans – life is full of them, but if I receive and AG cert eqsl that’s nice, I’m not desperate – it’s just good to receive any eqsl and have a look/see what they’ve done with their cards. If there’s no AG it doesn’t count to an award – but so what.. we build awards up slowly and life goes on if I don’t get my “Worked all Public Conveniences” award today ;-) in real life or e-virtual world..

I don’t “want” as you seem to imply meaning “demand” off people –Maybe in your mind but not mine and many others is that black thought. I just upload my logs and see what comes back.

Why not ask? – we don’t move forward if we just sit back and accept the situation. I’m not demanding, I thought quite a long time before posting – I’m not a regular forum spammer. It just occurred that as IOTA is popular around the world and the fuss and bother of posting real cards off for various awards to be confirmed could be a positive move for eQSL to do to raise the awareness and use of eQSL in the ham world. I am no after any ‘medals’ to show off – I felt eQSL was a good-thing and decided to give some money – but I don’t link status to whether I want or not to get a eqsl of someone. That seems an argument from elsewhere that I’ve no knowledge of.

I think efforts should be to convince the skeptical of the usefulness and appropriateness of having eQSL alongside QSLs. If there’s time I try to say to dx stations I work I’d welcome eqsls (especially if they mention no-eqsls) at least they know there is interest out there. Ham radio is a big hobby and room enough for others to have interests you may not have or want yourself –

Keep the awards and add more if there is time, money and interest, please.

Dave
G0CER

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G0CER Dave Harris

“Worked all Public Conveniences” award

Hey, you're on to something here. We could start a POTA (Potties on the air) club and people could activate them all over the world :)

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VE3OIJ P. Darin Cowan

I HAVE ALWAYS WONDERED WHY SOME STATIONS DO NOT(CAN NOT/WILL NOT)USE eQSL??
WITH THE COST OF FUEL GOING UP AND UP....HOW LONG WILL IT TAKE A POSTAL STAMP TO COST A DOLLAR?? IT COSTS 43 CENTS ALREADY....AND FUEL HAS DOUBLED IN THE LAST YEAR....IT WILL NOT BE LONG....................

LETS THINK GREEN HERE....NO FUEL TO HAVE YOUR eQSL CARD SENT AROUND THE WORLD....LET'S REDUCE OUR CARBON FOOT PRINT!..... IN MANY WAYS eQSL IS A PIONEER........WISH I HAD A COMPUTER IN 2000 THAT WOULD FIT IN MY 18 WHEELER, I WOULD HAVE BEEN USING eQSL A LOT SOONER!.......

SO........... WHO CAN GIVE USE MORE REASONS WHY eQSL IS A GREAT WAY TO SEND QSL CARDS AROUND THE WORLD???

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AB9QT Gilbert A. Daniel III

I am relatively new to ham radio & i think eqsl is a very fast & highly efficient way of sending and recieving qso confirmation however i am disapointed that organisations such as the rsgb iota do not accept eqsl,s as confirmation.I do want to chase awards but this creates the need for paper qsl cards other tha that eqsl is fantastic and much greener

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MM3RDP DAVID
Edited by MM3RDP DAVID on May 30, 2008 at 02:42 AM

The most common reasons I've heard:

1. I already use LOTW.
2. eQSL isn't accepted for <whatever> awards

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VE3OIJ P. Darin Cowan

Why is it always about the Awards or ARRL?
Both are fine and serve a good purpose. There's the joy in just getting a eQSL or a paper QSL from someone you've worked. Sure, awards are fun, but I just enjoy getting the QSLs and adding them to my electronic picture frame.
73

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N1ORK Orest 'Andy' Zajac

Not sure about ARRL: - yours was the first instance of ARRL on this page so far.

Fine idea with regards the digital-picture frame, at last someone came up with a decent use for them ! :)

I quite like the awards - I am watching my totals ever-so-slowly grow for the EDX100, I was a bit dissapointed after the ANARTS contest last weekend I worked at least 5 new countries, and as yet, no new eQSL countries amongst them. I'll keep trying, condx do seem to be on the up, my circle of coverage is bigger this year than last.. :)

- its a big hobby and there's room for all sorts of folks, even ones that collect eQSLs for competitive reasons.

73s Dave
G0CER

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G0CER Dave Harris

Hi Dave!
Oh sure, I like the awards and I'm at 59 for eDX100 and 41 for eWAS. I mentioned the ARRL for LOTW. In LOTW I have 62 countries and 43 states. When they come, they come. As for displaying the eQSLs, I also use a picture display gadget on my desktop that runs through my eQSLs like the digital picture frame, only smaller.
73
Andy

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N1ORK Orest 'Andy' Zajac
Edited by N1ORK Orest 'Andy' Zajac on Jun 19, 2008 at 11:18 PM

Couldn't agree with you more Andy

Awards are fun and that's just what they should be, they're a record of personal accomplishment, it's not a race simply 'goals' to which we all aspire.
When I'm in qso with stations it don't matter much to me whether they've achieved DXCC status or not I just enjoy the contact.

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Regards,
Martyn.

Remember, no matter what happens they can't hang you for it!